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Old 01-02-2016, 04:04 PM - Thread Starter
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Will I be happy going from plasma to 4k led?

Hey guys. For the last 10 years i have always bought plasma tv's. I have tried a few lcd tvs through out the years but everything always look so fake to me while watching tv so i would return them and get a plasma. I think its called the soap opera effect. The movement always looks so weird to me and i cant stand it. All the plasmas are perfect. I currently have a samsung 63" d8000 which is a few years old. I am getting the itch again for a new bigger tv. I am looking at a 75" samsung or vizio 4k tv now. But my big question is, will I have the same problem with the 4k led tv? Will everything look fake on this tv too compared to plasma? I dont know what I should do.
Anyone else make the switch that can chime in?
Thanks for all your help
Jon
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Old 01-02-2016, 04:57 PM
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depends on your priorities and WHICH 4k led you get(i mean there's a reason some are a few hundred and some are several thousand dollars)

personally, i haven't been looking actively since i bought the f8500, but i have not seen an LED i would replace it with, 4k or otherwise. for me the uniformity is a major deal breaker, and this is true of EVERY led i've seen unfortunately. i guess it's just one of those things. i don't understand how ppl obsess over dithering, or heat but it bugs some people. for me, i can't see past poor uniformity, i've actually returned 'high end' edgelit led's(two of them before i gave up) and paid extra for a lower model ccfl version.

however, if the soap opera effect is your only issue with led, it's an easy fix, turn off that 'feature'. i also hate the frame interpolation stuff, it's always turned off on my displays(some plasmas come with this now too!)

the other advice i would offer is to seriously consider a projector, especially if you don't need a tv, you're just looking for an upgrade. adding a projector and roll down screen to your current plasma will provide a whole lot more 'wow' than any tv.
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Old 01-03-2016, 04:48 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks you for the response.
I dont understand why people are concerned with some heat either. Doesnt bother me at all. I wish i could get a 75" plasma so they made plasma instead. Such a great tv. I had returned 2 lcd tvs as well because i just wasnt happy with them. I would always try to turn the soap oera effect off and try every option, but it would still look fake to me. Some options made it better or worse, but still bothered me. Then i would get my plasma back and right out of the box the motion was perfect. Not sure what to do.
Thanks again
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Old 01-03-2016, 08:24 AM
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Probably not, no. Unless you were to buy one of the top of line FALD LEDs. But even then...
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Old 01-03-2016, 08:29 AM
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The biggest LCD TV I ever owned was 32". For larger screens I went to DLP rear projection and then plasma. Looking at 4k TVs in the big box stores, I'm in awe of the fine details when standing 3' away. But when I back up to my normal viewing distance the fine detail disappears, and I still prefer the overall image produced by my 2 plasmas.

I have a lot of respect for Mark Henninger's (imagic's) opinions. His recommendation caused me to buy my last plasma before production stopped. In his review of the Vizio M65-C1 he concluded the following:

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Originally Posted by imagic View Post
... In a dark room, playing movies, the M65 manages to hold its own against one of the last and greatest plasma TVs ever made. If you add any ambient light to the equation, the M65 looks better than the plasma. Adding UHD/4K resolution to the mix, the M65 pulls even farther ahead of what the plasma can offer. If I had to choose between keeping my F8500 or trading it for the Vizio M65, it would be a difficult choice. While I appreciate the moments where the F8500 exhibits better contrast, and it's capacity for colorimetric perfection continues to impress (it'll continue to serve as my reference) the versatility of the M65 offers a sharp counterpoint to that.

When I think about how I considered the F8500 a bargain when I bought it on clearance for $2000, the fact the M65 sells for $1500 is a bit shocking. If this is trickle-down technology, I can't wait to see what the company has up its sleeve for the next generation of the higher-end P series.

If your primary interest is in a high-quality, low-cost 65" TV that's great for watching movies—and serving as a computer monitor—I doubt you can do better than the Vizio M series.
That's not enough to get me to exchange one of my still functioning plasmas. But if they were to stop working today at least I think I could probably live with a Vizio M series as a replacement. I think we're still a few years away from something that would actually cause me to want to exchange a functioning plasma for any LCD model. Until then I satisfy my urge for a larger screen by turning off my plasma and firing up my front projector.

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Old 01-03-2016, 09:14 AM
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Plasma = Cassete tape

4k = Digital Audio
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Old 01-03-2016, 11:15 AM - Thread Starter
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I just read the full review on the m series vizio tvs. Great review. It has been a few years since i tried my last lcd tv and in the review the guy didnt say anything about fake issues comparing to the plasma. Maybe it isnt a issue anymore like it used to be. Has anyone else made the switch? Curious what others thoughts were and if anyone else has experienced the fake look on the new led tv's
Thanks
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Old 01-03-2016, 11:34 AM - Thread Starter
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I just read the full review on the m series vizio tvs. Great review. It has been a few years since i tried my last lcd tv and in the review the guy didnt say anything about fake issues comparing to the plasma. Maybe it isnt a issue anymore like it used to be. Has anyone else made the switch? Curious what others thoughts were and if anyone else has experienced the fake look on the new led tv's
Thanks
Jon
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Old 01-03-2016, 12:31 PM
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There are Plasma owners that believe LCd is fake and will go OLED (some Plasma owners even believe that OLED is fake). Others don't mind going from Plasma to LCd. It is, at least partially, a individual thing. Buy a LCd and see for yourself, make shure that you can return it.
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Old 01-03-2016, 04:15 PM
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Try reading the Official 2015 Vizio 4K UHD M Series Thread. You could post a question there asking if any of the owners came over from plasma and asking what they think.
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Old 01-03-2016, 05:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RicFlair View Post
Plasma = Cassete tape
4k = Digital Audio
Really ? Even for a Samsung 8500 or a Panny ZT/VT ?

Which 4K's are going to beat them by that much and how much more over MSRP are we talking about ?

With very little 4K material, I wonder if it is worth it. Even if you have 4K stuff, would the 4K's blow away the 2K top-of-the-line plasmas ?
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Old 01-03-2016, 05:59 PM
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Just made the switch (not by choice) from Panasonic plasma to Panasonic LED. Wasn't too impressed to start but after some playing around much better. Still saying that loved the he plasma right up until it went poof. Will get this set calibrated after my new pre/pro shows up. Much clearer picture than the plasma but blacks not as deep colours how ever do pop.
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Old 01-03-2016, 09:09 PM
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Really, only YOU can answer that...

Spoiler!

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Old 01-03-2016, 09:25 PM

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Quote:
Originally Posted by maxfli44 View Post
Just made the switch (not by choice) from Panasonic plasma to Panasonic LED. Wasn't too impressed to start but after some playing around much better. Still saying that loved the he plasma right up until it went poof. Will get this set calibrated after my new pre/pro shows up. Much clearer picture than the plasma but blacks not as deep colours how ever do pop.
Any backlight bleeding/flashlighting or clouding on your set? Is it an OLED or LCD?
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Old 01-04-2016, 03:21 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for all the responses guys! I appreciate all the input
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Old 01-04-2016, 06:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RicFlair View Post
Plasma = Cassete tape

4k = Digital Audio
Yes.

The music i have on my legacy Cassette Tapes sounds richer and more natural than it does via Digital Audio sources.


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Old 01-04-2016, 09:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lovinthehd View Post
Any backlight bleeding/flashlighting or clouding on your set? Is it an OLED or LCD?
Have a bit of banding which is disappearing. Did the screen massage and it worked well, can only see it with bright white (hockey game) and movement. Going to have it calibrated after my new pre/pro gets here as my current one has its own video processing.
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Old 01-04-2016, 10:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RicFlair View Post
Plasma = Cassete tape

4k = Digital Audio
Your comment makes no sense. Comparing a extremely limited analog audio playback medium of the 60's to a technology like Plasma visual display shows incredible ignorance.

4k under perfect conditions, with the perfect source, has "better", resolution,than plasma, but there is little to no software availability, and the "quality" of the image is still in question.
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Old 01-04-2016, 11:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J02ws6transam View Post
Hey guys. For the last 10 years i have always bought plasma tv's. I have tried a few lcd tvs through out the years but everything always look so fake to me while watching tv so i would return them and get a plasma. I think its called the soap opera effect. The movement always looks so weird to me and i cant stand it. All the plasmas are perfect. I currently have a samsung 63" d8000 which is a few years old. I am getting the itch again for a new bigger tv. I am looking at a 75" samsung or vizio 4k tv now. But my big question is, will I have the same problem with the 4k led tv? Will everything look fake on this tv too compared to plasma? I dont know what I should do.
Anyone else make the switch that can chime in?
Thanks for all your help
Jon
That is a tough one to answer. I came from a Panasonic S1 series Plasma to my new Samsung JS8500 65 inch TV. If you're worried about black levels, don't be. The black levels on my new Samsung are really quite good, to the point that I don't miss my Plasma in that regard. Now, I will say, that when I got my Samsung, I got it because of a great deal before Christmas. I was very much, however, leaning toward one of Sony's X850C/X900C televisions. I do believe they exhibit a picture quality a bit more like Plasma then the Samsung's. But the Sony's also seem to lack the visual pop the Samsung's display. Obviously you can fiddle with settings, calibrate, and get them close. I did go from a 42 inch to a 65 inch television, so in that regard, I'm loving it. The upscaling is quite excellent, there seems less lag on my new Samsung then my old Panasonic Plasma when gaming. Honestly, I'd not go back to my Panasonic. It had an excellent picture, but I do love my new Samsung. But I will say, I do have screen issues. In fact, the manufacturer is having to replace the screen for me. So just be aware, you need to look at the screen with a fairly critical eye. Also, though the black levels are quite good, I do occasionally bristle at the glow that sometimes shows up in dark areas of the screen at brief interludes when something in the center of the screen lights up. I'm waiting to see if this improves when they service my new TV. I know it sounds like I'm discouraging you. But if you're looking for a larger screen.. I think the trade off is worth it. By all means get OlED though if you can afford it. But if you can't.. get a new LED. I would suggest, however, making certain you pick one up with a 10-bit panel that offers HDR. If you can afford the additional benefit of FALD, also go that route.
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Old 01-04-2016, 01:42 PM
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I have the 60 inch F8500 and just bought the 60 inch Vizio M for another room.
I love the M! I am also very particular about light bleed and I don't notice any issues with uniformity. Prior to buying the F8500 I had owned another Samsung Plasma that died, I tried a Sony LED and returned it. Didnt like the edge lit at all.
For pure picture quality, to my eye, I can't see a noticeable difference between the M and F8500. I actually think I prefer the Vizio picture.
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Old 01-04-2016, 03:55 PM - Thread Starter
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Thank you for all the detailed responses. I really helps alot to hear opinions from guys that made the same switch, I have always been a die hard samsung tv guy. The last 4 tvs i had were all samsung, but i have to say i have been reading alot about the new m series from vizio and everyone seems to love it. I was looking at the 75" M series tv and read so many reviews on the tv and peoples opinions, and haven't read anything bad yet. I was looking at a 75" 4k samsung that my local sams club had on sale for $2400, but i know its a lower series of samsung, but still seems the vizio is a better tv from what i am reading.
Thanks again
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Old 01-05-2016, 02:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J02ws6transam View Post
Thank you for all the detailed responses. I really helps alot to hear opinions from guys that made the same switch, I have always been a die hard samsung tv guy. The last 4 tvs i had were all samsung, but i have to say i have been reading alot about the new m series from vizio and everyone seems to love it. I was looking at the 75" M series tv and read so many reviews on the tv and peoples opinions, and haven't read anything bad yet. I was looking at a 75" 4k samsung that my local sams club had on sale for $2400, but i know its a lower series of samsung, but still seems the vizio is a better tv from what i am reading.
Thanks again
Jon
Im happy with my Panasonic ZT60, Panasonic 42" PX500U and my Sony 32" plasma. I don't think i would ever do LED except.. maybe..maybe OLED. But thats after my TVs stop working, which I don't expect anytime soon. My dad had this very expensive Sharp LED master series or something.. piece of crap only lasted 1 year. My oldest plasma is > 12 years and still going! LEDs always bothered me, the weird motion and the poor off angle viewing. Whats up with that? I have sit directly in front of my TV to get the best picture or it washes out??? Thats so dumb!

Mo!
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Old 01-05-2016, 05:45 PM
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Just make sure the LCD you choose has a bevy of motion options (I. e. impulse modes, black frame insertion, etc.) and a high refresh rate.
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Old 01-05-2016, 07:17 PM
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Quote:
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Your comment makes no sense. Comparing a extremely limited analog audio playback medium of the 60's to a technology like Plasma visual display shows incredible ignorance.

4k under perfect conditions, with the perfect source, has "better", resolution,than plasma, but there is little to no software availability, and the "quality" of the image is still in question.
The mid table 4K blows away the Kuro Plasma -end this thread. Stop with the black levels nonsense - nobody watches a TV and says ohhhh looka the depth of the blacks - people see my 4K Jumbotron and ask me if it's a fish tank.
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Old 01-05-2016, 07:50 PM
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Thanks you for the response.
I dont understand why people are concerned with some heat either. Doesnt bother me at all. I wish i could get a 75" plasma so they made plasma instead. Such a great tv. I had returned 2 lcd tvs as well because i just wasnt happy with them. I would always try to turn the soap oera effect off and try every option, but it would still look fake to me. Some options made it better or worse, but still bothered me. Then i would get my plasma back and right out of the box the motion was perfect. Not sure what to do.
Thanks again
Jon
but not be what's usually referred to as SOE then, but more an issue with the way lcd's inherently produce motion. the really unfortunate thing is that even oled uses a similar 'sample and hold' method so they may present the same issues with motion. i personally am not bothered by lcd motion, just by frame interpolation(so turning it off was enough for me) and i hate, hate, hate edgelighting. i don't understand how it was ever considered acceptable. reminds me of girls walking like newborn calves on their 8inch heels. i don't care how 'good it looks' if it's not functional.

as for heat, i'm not sure where you live, but at least for me, 8months out of the year, it just means my furnace doesn't have to work as hard

i'll say the projector again, seriously consider it if it's at all doable for you. a DLP based projector may be your last hope of a larger screen with good motion.

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Old 01-05-2016, 07:54 PM
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Originally Posted by RicFlair View Post
Plasma = Cassete tape

4k = Digital Audio
maybe true if digital audio is mp3's

but seriously, 4k is not the problem. necessary or not, it IS an upgrade over 1080p. the problem is still the same old plasma vs lcd debate, and 4k really has done nothing to change that. if you had a problem with 1080p lcd, you're still going to have a problem with 4k lcd
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Old 01-05-2016, 07:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MattG! View Post
I have the 60 inch F8500 and just bought the 60 inch Vizio M for another room.
I love the M! I am also very particular about light bleed and I don't notice any issues with uniformity. Prior to buying the F8500 I had owned another Samsung Plasma that died, I tried a Sony LED and returned it. Didnt like the edge lit at all.
For pure picture quality, to my eye, I can't see a noticeable difference between the M and F8500. I actually think I prefer the Vizio picture.
it's good to know that should something happen, there's at least ONE option out there today. it's even better when it's not a mega-buck hard to find model!

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Old 01-05-2016, 08:09 PM
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The mid table 4K blows away the Kuro Plasma -end this thread. Stop with the black levels nonsense - nobody watches a TV and says ohhhh looka the depth of the blacks - people see my 4K Jumbotron and ask me if it's a fish tank.
you have different friends than i do...

#blacksdomatter

but again, it's two completely different things. 4k is good. at least it's not 'worse' in any way. i don't think ppl here have anything against 4k, we just question whether it's actually needed or not. but you still need a good display if you want a good image. i'm pretty sure that seiki 4k is not going to be replacing anybody's kuro anytime soon. it's probably not going to be replacing anybody's sharp elite either. and agree with it or not, there are some things that plasmas do that lcd's don't. if you're a person that values those things, then 4k won't make up for it. the way you feel about 'blacks' is the same way i feel about brightness. if my plasma is MORE than bright enough, why would i obsess over more brightness? if your lcd is MORE than black enough, then why should you obsess about MLL's? we shouldn't, but that's still no excuse to be ignorant. enjoy your fish tank with your friends(there's no way to type that so it doesn't sound sarcastic but i mean it sincerely, it's good that we have options, or we used to anyway)
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Old 01-06-2016, 07:06 AM
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I might be in the minority, but i just switched from a FALD 4k tv to a kuro plasma and couldnt be happier and more impressed!

The plasma delivered a much better picture than the 4k ever could, plus the shadowing/blocking of the lcd was driving me crazy!

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Old 01-06-2016, 08:56 AM
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The mid table 4K blows away the Kuro Plasma -end this thread.
At a recent Shootout the ZT60 Plasma (which is slightly better than the top Pioneer Plasma's) was compared to the best TV on the market, the CZ950 Panasonic OLED. According experts the ZT60 comfortably held its own 90% of the time, exhibited better screen uniformity (particulary near black) and higher motion clarity than the CZ950. So... ..btw good luck with your ''mid table 4K
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